Third Nature Therapy

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Ezra Klein and Jia Tolentino on Dissociation

Learn why dissociation happens to us all.

Ezra Klein and Jia Tolentino spoke on The Ezra Klein Show this past week on children, meaning, media, and psychedelics. This episode was so intensely pleasurable for me to listen to—two people, both way smarter than me, discussing my daily existential thoughts.

So many themes! Deciding to have a child. Psychedelics. The human need to dissociate. 

I want to explore the idea of the human need to "zone out" or dissociate a bit more.  Even before listening, I've been sort of obsessed with this all summer.

What is dissociation?

Dissociation exists on a continuum.

Dissociation can feel like relatively mild sensations of fogginess, sleepiness, or difficulty concentration to feeling numb and cut off.

In some extreme situations, people might have lapses of memory or lost time. 

From a physiological (bodily) perspective, dissociation can be thought of as a biological protection mechanism that disconnects an individual from threatening experiences. 

And from a psychological (mental) perspective, dissociation is a way of coping with an overwhelming situation. 

What dissociation feels like

Disocciation creates a split in self.

This split occurs between the part that is going on with daily living, and the part that is holding onto the painful experiences of the past.

Splitting occurs between these two states so overwhelming feelings of pain and trauma don’t get in the way of functioning.

There are two common forms of dissociation:

  • Depersonalization - disconnection from one’s own thoughts, feelings, body sensations, and behaviors.

  • Derealization - disconnection from the world and your ability to see things accurately.

Why dissociation happens

We all need to dissociate or “check out” (this might not be the right word—perhaps one day we'll find a more accurate descriptor), and there's nothing inherently good or bad about that. 

Take being a therapist, for instance. I have heard from countless supervisors and leaders in the field that a caseload of 14-16 clients a week is the sweet spot for a regulated nervous system. 

Why? 

Well, for many reasons, but most importantly, because we only have a limited capacity of attuned attention to give to clients each day, and over-scheduling ourselves doesn't allow us to show up with truly regulated nervous systems. 

A large part of my job is being present, regulated, and attuned to my clients. 

But that level of attention also makes me tired afterward, which means I then have a limited capacity for a deep, focused presence elsewhere.

I could fight this and feel shame for not being "tougher."

Or, I can listen to what my brain and body are telling me and take time to let my attention be less focused.

When doing something intensely and with focus at any point during our day, we also need to balance that with doing less intense things. That's how we're all wired. 

Dissociation can also be a trauma response. When experiencing something traumatic, unsafe, overwhelming, we have an innate ability to leave our bodies to escape the suffering that’s happening.

The pain can be overwhelming, and so we dissociate.

It’s a psychological defense that separates conscious awareness from frighteneing feelings or memories. This split allows people to keep the intolerable emotions, sensations, and intolerable arousal states out of self-awareness.

Is dissociation good or bad?

Dissociation can be good and even helpful when experiencing a traumatic event. But, if we haven’t healed from trauma, our brains might think trauma is still occurring, and we continue to dissociate.

In that case, dissociation isn’t good and impacts your ability to stay present and enjoy your life. 

Can dissociation be good?

What if we all stopped denying that our need to dissociate existed and instead found ways that don't cause negative impacts on our mental health (i.e., social media)? 

Instead of using social media, I've been playing Sudoku lately to unwind. My partner listens to Taylor Swift, and Ezra Klein mentions he reads a hard-copy magazine.

I get asked A LOT by clients for examples of healthy ways to zone out that aren’t Instagram and I would love to have more options to share.  

Feel free to reach out and tell me what works for you!

And listen to this episode and let me know your thoughts on healthy ways to zone out.

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More notes on trauma and dissociation :

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Julie Goldberg is a licensed therapist and the founder of Third Nature Therapy. Her practice focuses on helping individuals better understand their inner world, befriend their nervous system (instead of working against it), and navigate changing relationships. She offers somatic therapy, EMDR intensives, and Ketamine-Assisted Psychotherapy in Brooklyn, NY.